Posts by DS
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Robot has been extended 3.2m arm to 3.5m. If I do clean install of KSS, will I have to re-enter some of those parameters somewhere? Or shall I take a note of some file that keeps robot sizes before I do install KSS?
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MOM, panic mode, pipo, and all who chipped in advice,
Thank you for your continuous support - the next milestone is done - original EDC card was healthy and was cloned to another EDC card.
A few notes for readers who may benefit from this story:
- Cloning was done using Acronis Disk Director 12.5 (I do not have KUKA Recovery USB), Demo version was free for disks till 10 GB, my KUKA disc is 8 GB - great - thanks to Acronis! When doing cloning I opted for "Copy NT signature" (using it important not to restart PC with both cards, better no card attached). Acronis software did not offer an option to go file or sector based.
- Long story short Innolite EDC drawing of pin numbers is very tricky, easy to confuse, as it is an old card not used by many, will not go into details
- I got two new Cablexpert USB to IDE/SATA converters (AUSI01), they have the same problem as previous converters in that you cannot plug Innolite EDC card in them (both female) and you cannot use simple 40 Pin board (as I mistakenly did before). Pins are - as I wrote in #76 - mirrored! Getting mirrored pin slots would take me several days, I wanted to get this done over weekend so, believe it or not I had to do 2x39 pins from paperclips Please, do not judge They worked!
- As you suggested I used regular Windows 10 laptop to carry out the cloning, this indeed saves hassle of mingling with insides of old PC or BIOS. If not for the pins cloning is 15 min, very simple operation.
So far so good doing first ever clone. Now I expect things to go even more interesting (complex) as based on pipo suggestion I shall take newly created EDC, put it in controller PC and try to reinstall/restore. There are several restore options, including all. Please, based on #44 let me know what you suggest. To summarize #44 - robot startup would freeze in Cross3 and would not progress up until I did End Tasked Explorer, Guardtray, and Guard9x apps.
Will report back on how KRC2 startup with copy of EDC will go - I expect same issues (as physically there were no issues with disk) but I will report what it is!
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MOM, yes I agree with you USB to IDE converter is preferable and I will definitely take it into account as a way forward!!! You are also right - there is one IDE 40pin port (used by CD/DVD), but not two (so I am not sure how one can help cloning). With Hirens I actually need that port for CD as I was unable to create Bootable USB stick, it corrupted 2 USBs for some reason and the Hirens version that was working (15.2) said it is bootable from CD or HDD, not USB even though in BIOS USB Booting was enabled....
Thanks for sector-based vs file-based pics!
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pipo, MOM, sorry, I think I have made a mistake in connecting converter and EDC wrong. I think you are right. I connected EDC to converter like in the picture but they are both meant to be plugged in male slots, which means I did it wrong and it also means I cannot simply turn them 180 degrees. They have to be mirrored. I think it is this connector in pic below that I had to buy instead to connect converter to EDC. Perhaps it explains why cards were warming up. Hope I have not already destroyed them by plugging them wrong.
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Thanks for your analysis and comments!
To conclude on SATA <-> IDE converter:
- HW-wise it was only one option how I could connect: MB <> SATA cord <SATA/ IDE converter> EDC card (no options there)
- On converter I can choose "SATA to IDE" or "IDE to SATA" switch + jumper near the switch (2 options)
- In BIOS Drive configuration there is "Configure SATA as" <IDE> or <AHCI> (2 options)
- in BIOS S.M.A.R.T. can be <Enabled> or <Disabled> (2 options)
So I actually did run through all combinations, none worked, so it is likely wrong converter HW.
Will think of next steps based on all the advice and will report back!
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to be sure, again tried to change BIOS to " S.M.A.R.T. <Disable>" and "Configure SATA as <ACHI>". None of the 3 combinations worked.
Is there anything I can do in booted Windows XP Mini to try to install my missing drives? Install All Hardware Force?
Or shall I just get another old PC with IDE slots? Or shall I prepare boot on USB and attempt to create clone on controller's PC?
Or go to some service provider and ask them to make clone?
What do you think is the safest/best way to proceed?
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This is the manual. The bit about jumpers I am not getting, but I assume that is not what I have to use.
https://gembird.nl/Repository/678…6c79097c090.pdf
To get the facts right into the history of the forum, attaching pic of home PC MB
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Hi,
Thanks for your comments and questions.
A quick summary of thread as it is quite long by now
- Interim target is to clone HDD of controller PC but controller PC did not come with HDD instead it has EDC in IDE slot of controller's PC MB. So the target is to clone ESD.
- To not mess with cloning on controller's PC I opted to do it on an old PC I have at home but that PC indeed only has plenty of SATA ports, no IDE plug on MB. So I got SATA to IDE (and vice versa) converters and hoped EDC cards will be recognized
- Yesterday I successfully launched Clonezilla on home PC but it failed to recognize EDC cards. pipo recommended to play with IDE mode. panic mode suggested turning off SMART mode. I did all that but unfortunately no combination lead to Clonezilla recognizing any of the 2 drives.
- Following pipo suggestion today I got to Hiren's Boot CD. USB for some reason did not work but I burned HirensBootCD 15.2 on CD and as the home PC has DVD drive. I successfully booted Mini Windows XP, got to Device Manager but did not see EDC or any HDD. Just to double-check that this booted windows recongnizes HDD I pluged one regular empty SATA HDD back, scanned for new devices and it found it. So issue seems to be with booted Mini Windows not recognizing EDC via SATA to IDE converter.
- I double-checked converter manual (link in next post). I assume I have to use SATA to IDE converter mode.
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Hi,
Today finally received two SATA to IDE converters. The old PC I have is Windows XP with 2 HDD physical drives in SATA ports. I took USB flash and created Clonezilla on it. I disconnected HDDs and connected original EDC from controller PC as well as empty EDC (both via SATA to IDE converters). Launched Clonezilla (all good), got till screen where I have to choose source disk and Clonezilla tells me: "To do local disk to disk clone, there must be at least 2 harddisks in the machine! Only 1 disk is found!".
I checked the basics, power is supplied to both EDCs and converters, green lights on both, converter switches to right positions according to converter manual, both cards are lightly warm.
I checked BIOS and under Advanced -> Drive Configuration it shows all SATA Ports as [Not Installed]. See pic. I have no experience with these things. I would guess that new hardware have to be installed...can I do it via BIOS? Any advice much appreciated.
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Thanks, this is helpful to know.
Oldest PC I have is with two SATA HDD slots. Just ordered two SATA to IDE converters. Will let you know
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pipo, Thanks, yes I agree. The only nuance is my current KRC2 system does not have any HDD! It only has InnoDisk InnoLite EDC 40P-V 8 GB (DE0H-08GD51AC1DN) Embedded Disk Card attached to motherboard. I am currently in the process of getting exact same old EDC card model so when I do my first ever clone and physically change cards on motherboard I have less potential issues. Not sure if this assumption is correct.
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sjx, MOM, panic mode thanks!
I did start up controller and after Cross3 stuck again I used Ctrl+ALT+Delete to see what's wrong and I saw Explorer [Not responding]. So selected End Task for Explorer, than Ctrl+ALT+Delete and this time it showed Guardtray [Not responding], so I ended that, too. Next one was Guard9x [Not responding] -> End Task. Then KUKA started loading!!!
sjx, read the threads you found, many thanks! I looked in to C:\KRC\BIN, there was no .freeze file (maybe I received robot with that file deleted). I forced cold Starup. Interestingly, the screen when on to stay long after I switched the cabinet off (this did not happen before)!! Now I remember, that some long time ago it used to be that after power off screen stayed on for some seconds. Not recently. Screen acts as if controller 2 batteries were old but they are not old, changed recently. When I started the cabinet on I got the same problem with Cross3 freezing Cold start did not help.
I did all the same End Tasks for Explorer, Guardtray and Guard9x and KUKA loaded again. This time there were no usual messages ("Reboot after powerfail" or "Ackn. under voltage PM1")! Am I normally shutting the controller down incorrectly (by power off knob on controller?) Shall I always use Cold Startup to get it boot without powerfail messages? For what its worth, I tried Shutdown option in Windows, it got me to windows restarting and into dark screen later...
So I did warm power on again. This time only Guardtray End Task (Explorer, Guard9x were not indicated as problem) an KUKA started loading and never finished (just showing clock item)...obviously I should have ended Explorer and Guard9x....
Restart again, End Tasked all 3 apps, checked C:\KRC\BIN. No .freeze. There are Cross3, KukaBof, KukaDB, OleTest, vxworks.debug, and vxWorks.st files there. So I went to to Monitor -> Diagnosis -> Log book -> Display. Last logs seem for the day when things went wrong. One strange message I see "Safety circuit has detected an error. Use ESC-Diagnose for further information".
Will try to unplug X21 when pendant not lighting next time...
Also, apparently I have lost mastering, but that's not an issue, I have done it before...
I assume now I have the chance to use File -> Restore -> after I have cloned SSD card to at least be able to get back where I am now if it does not work as I have no Windows CD.
What do you think about Guardtray, Guard9x?
Sorry for long post, just wanted to document it properly
Thanks for all your guidance!
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Probably unrelated... back in the old days when things were running smooth there always has been this message on the screen after KUKA initiated. This seems to be some extension from previous owner, not sure what is StatKeyBar request, could it be that this extension is blocking loading of KSS? I never acted on this.
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Hi,
Yesterday received ATX replacement and the journey could continue. The first lesson I learned is that I shall listen more carefully to you, guys! javaman, you are right - voltage of ATX shall be tested on fully running system. Red and yellow wires are easy to measure on free 4 pin connector near CDROM, orange wire I measured on 20 pin connector form the other side. Both ATXes gave similar measurements that were well within the +/- 4% range.
About starting up the PC. I have to say I am a bit embarrassed. pipo , panic mode, you correctly told me to use paper clip as power button but I wrongly misinterpreted that 20 pin connector shall be out (and we are doing this to just validate ATX). Yesterday I did three things together:
a) I placed paper clip from green to black from the other side of 20 pin connector, with all ATX wires/plugs connected to PC
b) I connected controller to PC cords (because external screen did not light up doing just "a)" and I wanted to use pendant's screen that way)
c) I did "power on" by paperclip for 2nd consecutive time (as you may remember I still have this issue that on every 1st poweron, pendant is not showing anything)
All these 3 conditions together + external keybord made pendant show startup on 2nd attempt. Using external keybord I was able to enter BIOS and load & save KUKA default settings.
With this battery on motherboard is successfully changed and I am back on square one with status:
1) system fully powers on with every 2nd consecutive time (even ~ 5 min power down will make system not start on 1st power on but only on 2nd) - but this is not the main issue
2) after successful launching of Windows, startup stops on "Cross 3" (pic attached)
My plan (as suggested by pipo) is to:
- get same SSD HW as I currently have (Innolite EDC) and clone it.
- save original, put cloned SSD into controller PC and re-install KSS.
Great, if you guys have any other ideas of what I can attempt to do to correct "2)" while I wait for SSD HW!
If KUKA software is not launching itself, could there be a way I manually start it up?
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with my limited knowledge I think it would be wise to stick to standard 24V input ATX
regarding the boards, yes, I'd like to continue to debug but:
a) If MB would work, I still need to replace ATX given that that PC was not booting every first time I switched on controller for already a few months
b) if MB would not work, I will not know if it is due to wrong incoming voltage or MB has been damaged
Therefore, I think the next step could be to replace ATX and then power up PC w/o controller data cables and see if all the boards work and I can access BIOS.
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I guess due to external links one of my posts were "Disabled" here it goes w/o links:
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To continue...
ATX current model is in the picture above
A quick search for that same model on ebay gives used one for EUR ~250, a new one 5x more!
Is this the type of device that can damage motherboard and cards if voltages are incorrect? Or are those cards protected and it is ok to opt for used ATX?
Thanks
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To continue...
ATX current model is in the picture below
A quick search for that same model on ebay gives used one for EUR ~250, a new one 5x more!
Is this the type of device that can damage motherboard and cards if voltages are incorrect? Or are those cards protected and it is ok to opt for used ATX?
Thanks
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pipo , panic mode , MOM, javaman, and everyone
I just want to say thank you for your continuous support during this adventure (and my learning in this realm that is new for me).
Guess we have arrived at a milestone:
- I disconnected motherboard, cards, SSD and even CDROM form ATX, leving only the fan
- also I disconnected all incoming cables from controller to PC leaving only the power cord
- I did put paperclip from green to black and after I switched on the power the fan was turning
- then I measured the 20 pin connector voltages and I was in for a surprise (this is what I got, my numbers in blue)
robot-forum.com/attachment/27162/
This is far from allowed range and clearly do not match output values on ATX box legend.
The date on ATX box is May 2004