jarm Hey im still trying to figure theese calculations out and im getting nowhere.
Could you please provide an example of the calculations for me, it would be greatly appreciated.
jarm Hey im still trying to figure theese calculations out and im getting nowhere.
Could you please provide an example of the calculations for me, it would be greatly appreciated.
i will later..im a bit busy today...btw turn off the speed data on your weld points,,,just the approach point before the arc on instruction has speed data for the point. The rest of the points in the weld should be just movl instruction with no speed data. Your arc file contains the speed of the weld.
Probably the reason your having issues. If you didnt use an arc file and had the voltage and current on the arcon line then you need to include speed tags on the movl points.
I have questions in regards how your robot uses the power source weld settings. How do you tell the controller you're using the settings on the power source. Do you still use an arcfile for arc on?
If you use the arc file, i dont think the pendent software has a place for wire speed. Its just your voltage, current and travel speed. I think i had to measure the wire feed based on the current settings when creating arc files.
What is the formula for setting up GMAW ? (weldingtipsandtricks.com)
Try googling and see if you can get any other info for calculating wirespeed from amperage.
I cant remember quite how i figured it out. Whether i used info from a chart or if i somehow fed a length of wire over a certain time with the arc turned off but i'm not entirely sure how i would have done that either. Turning the arc off stops the feed and welding in space would trigger arc start fault after no ignition. it would be nice to have an accurate wirespeed for your calculations
jarm Hey, greatly appreciate your time in this !
So the first question would be, how do i not include a speed tag for the mov instruction ?
We currently dont use Arc files because our Weld source " doesnt have the communication card to communicate with the robot " this is what my boss explained to me.
We are using Binzel iRob Pulse 500.
Currently how we are doing our welds is We use "macros" to call the parameter list from our Welding source, and then use "manual settings" with ARCON AC=200 V=100% example if we want to up the current from 180Amps etc.
Our Welding power source file isnt set up for our Weld source at all ( because my boss stated like i mentioned above).
Now im not sure but i assume that if our welding Power source file isnt set up correctly, all the Arc start files / end files etc. cannot be used properly, since our welding power source file isnt set up correctly and an command of 180A isnt actually what is being output at the wire ?
When i started out i was exclusevly using Arc start files, now i switched to only using macros to call the parameters from our weld source.
We set the Welding parameters on our power source, Wire feed speed is the main parameter that also controlls Amperage and Voltage if that makes sense. It also has an option to set the parameters individually but I havent tried it out yet.
Here is a link to one of our parameters settings : https://imgur.com/a/welding-parameters-weld-source-GGBp484.
Another update since last time: My boss want the robot weld speed to be in the 50cm/min move speed range for welding so we have to find new parameters for those speeds. Currently we mostly welded in the 35 cm/min range and the welds produced were 90% satisfactory.
Now with the new wish of higher speeds ill need to up the Amperage,voltage and feed speed quite a lot.
For example i did some tests yesterday and for 10mm T joint steel came to the parameters of 261A, 34.6 V and 16.2 m/min with the travel speed of 50cm/min to be producing somewhat satisfactory welds.
I also did some calculations yesterday for a theoretical example of a weld. Could you provide some input if this is correct?
Wire deposition rate : 13.1 x D^2 x WFSx Electrode efficiency = 5.95 kg/hr = 0.001653 kg/s
D=0.04 inch ; WFS = 637.8 IPM; Electrode efficiency = 0.9
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Weld Volume = A x l = 7 200 mm^3
A= (khatet^2)/2 = (6^2)/2 ; l = 400mm
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Mass of the weld : V x Specific density = 7 200 x10^-6 m^3 x 7 900 kg/m^3 = 0.057 kg.
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Now i divided the Mass of the weld with wire deposition rate to get approximate time required to fill the weld up:
0.057kg/0.001653 kg/s = 34.48 s
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Now i divide the time required to fill the weld with the length of the weld ( 400mm) to get my travel speed for the parameters ?
400mm/34.48s = 11.6 mm/s = 69.6 cm/min travel speed ?
Would this be correct ?
i'll look over your calculation later....im at work. hit edit at the top and a menu will open. you should be able to disable the speed tags there. You will likley have to recreate the point without the tag and delete the one with. i don't think you can remove it once its there. so you'll need to go to each point to create and delete..
oh wait...if your not using the arcfiles then you probable need the tags....do some tests. See what happens. Does the weld settings on the power source have a setting for travel speed? Im not familiar with that setup with a power source, using macros.
I believe i did it a little differently..
pick a length of weld, say 30.5 cm and calculate weld volume for the size of your weld. then calculate the length of wire to fill that weld. then calculate the wfs based on the time to do 30.5cm at 50 cm/min (36.6 seconds or 0.61 minutes) so wfs=Length of wire/0.61 minutes. just convert everything into the units the machine uses before the calculation.
The length of wire should be (weld volume / Pi R^2). if your vol is in cubic mm and R is in mm then length should be in mm. If cm^3 then r should be in same unit (cm). r is wire radius. Just be aware of the units is all im saying
With only a 90% efficiency, I just add another 10% to the length of wire but that really depends on the transfer type. Globular will be less efficient then a spray transfer
. It was all fine tuning after that. to do the deposition rate you need to know the wfs first. my wfs speed was tied to my current settings and im running 350-400amps for the size welds im running
jarm Hey, thanks, take all the time you need, there is no hurry !
As far as i know ( i did some testing) the ARC files seem to take priority over Macros which we use to call our Welding parameters from the Weld source. Either that or my assumption is incorrect and the ASF took priority because it first exectues the macro then ASF ( ladder type reading of the program if you know what i mean)
I tested this by calling our welding parameters first and then i used Arc set file right after and it took into account the travel speed and current programmed in the arc file ( would need to make another test and make a bigger difference in the Amp settings for example calling a macro with I=200A and then use an arc set file with I=100 Amps so the difference is visible).
Program example of ASF & AEF and weld results: https://imgur.com/a/aef-program-results-vylCBBJ
After i inspected the welding table, it stated that the movement of the robot during welding was 30cm/min like i specified it in the ASF .
You can definitely weld the same weld at different travel speeds. You just need to compensate the heat so you're putting in enough heat/time for fusion. you should be able to adjust your voltage and current values to get the right heat, transfer type and bead shape. leaving the calculated travel speed and wfs alone unless you think you're getting too much or not enough wire. You know that you are putting in the exact calculated volume of wire at the right travel speed to obtain the right sized weld. The heat and current should be the only thing to adjust after that. You may want to calculate the heat of fusion for your parts and set your heat and amps to closely match that while using the preferred transfer type. It's a little playing around but having the right wfs and travel speed for the right sized weld is 1/2 the battle
For welding 3/16 inch thick material, a typical heat input range would be between 35 and 65 kJ/in
Hi=A∗V∗S/L
To calculate heat input required for welding, multiply the current by the voltage by the time, then divide by the length. as long as your settings are somewhere in that range you should be good. you can calculate good voltage and current from this formula to test. I would just use 26-27 volts. You know the time and length, calculate a current based on a 50kj/in heat input.
(Hi x L) / (V x S) = A
That might be a good place to start
Unless he's needing to conform to a certified welding procedure I think calculating the deposition rate it getting too technical.
If you want to change the size of the weld, change the travel speed; the penetration, change the voltage or trim level in this case. It's a bit more complicated with using pulse welding because of the trim level. Basically, you'll get a wider weld with less spatter if you set the trim level higher. If you have problems with melt through but need the speed, then lower the trim level. Some welders might use the label "arc length". The wave control can change arc characteristic some too. In pulse welding the operator sets his trim level or arch length and his wire feed speed and travel speed and the welding powersource controls the voltage.
Here is a weld schedule for pulse welding that I use with a Lincoln powersource. The delay time is your crater fill but I like to make another weld schedule for crater fill that is lower wire feed speed, say 200 IPM. and lower trim say 0 or .5.
Here's an example of how it's used though the schedule number is different, the number in brackets after the "arc start" command it the weld schedule number. Here the "WELD_SPEED" means it's using the weld speed set in the schedule. If I don't like the size of the weld I can change it to whatever speed I want. It's really quite simple.
Your CO2 percentage is high for spray welding but it should work for short circuit and pulse welding. An alternative blend would be 10% or less of CO2.
it's more of a calculation to find the right wfs and travel speed to get the right sized weld. Im not really using any deposition rate calculations. Im just taking a calculated weld volume from a weld of known size and length and finding out how much wire that is. Taking the length of wire and time to do the weld to figure the wfs. Once you have those 2 settings im using heat of the weld calculation for the voltage and current setting. It will get him close. Then i would use your suggestions to fine tune it. not sure weaving it at 50cm/min is a great idea. Thats nearly 20 ipm. If so, id go with a very low freq and a small amplitude to try it first and work the amplitude up from there. dont want it weaving like sewing machine on full throttle