Twincat Runtime in KRC4

  • Hi people,

    i wanted to install the Twincat 3 runtime XAR in KUKA KRC4,

    i installed it but now when i try to start the runtime it gives me error saying:


    Init4\Rtime: start interrupt: Ticker started >> AdsError: 4122

    (0x101a, Rtime: enter real time mode fails: enabling Intel VT-x fails!)


    i am looking for the error solution, but have anyone of you guys tried such thing before, i mean Twincat runtime in KUKA before,

    please let me know if you have and want to see if i can go further with this.

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  • solution is to use dedicated hardware for your TwinCat runtime. i am (occasionally) running runtime on my laptop and even after dedicating CPU cores to it, my machine still tends to crash if any software using virtualization is running at the same time (vmware, virtualbox etc). i would not want that to happen on some production system such as robot. btw KRC4 uses dual core CPU and already runs two operating systems - vxworks and windows. and each CPU core is already utilized for specific tasks (motion planning, safety). installing 3rd party application like notepad++ or so is one thing but - i would not want TwinCat there.

    1) read pinned topic: READ FIRST...

    2) if you have an issue with robot, post question in the correct forum section... do NOT contact me directly

    3) read 1 and 2

  • i see, thankyou panic mode.

    it was hasty move of mine to try to install some other runtime in KRC, i was trying that for research purpose, when i asked KUKA support and even Beckhoff support both of them said 'we dont recommend it'. and both of support said ' they have no idea regarding this' and they were looking forward to my response regarding this.

    Ofcourse recommendation is one thing but getting technical answer is other thing. since you gave me a proper reason why i shouldnt go for this, may be i will halt the process.

    but it is always interesting to do this kind of new things.

    but thankyou anyways.

  • BTW panic mode i have one question:

    so you mentioned you have couple of time used laptop for the runtime,

    does this mean your laptop will be able to do the Logic operation just like PLC and be used for controlling different kinematics, conveyors, servos or steppers.

    or is it just for simulation?


    if it somehow does the logic operation for controlling external devices then probably i would want to try that out. also i am relatively new to these platforms so i am struggling thats why i keep on asking stupid question please dont mind.

  • Quote

    so you mentioned you have couple of time used laptop for the runtime

    yes, that is how one tests code before dumping the project to a PLC.


    you can get a dedicated PC or RaspberryPI or similar and use it for same job. if you are not using Beckhoff hardware, you need to add license. nice thing about this is that you can scale things up or down based on your needs. if you need more processing power, no problem, just get some fancy really powerful Godzilla computer and run runtime there - your problems are solved.


    runtime that is installed on development station (my laptop) is the same thing and it too needs license. but there one use free license (generate one when prompted).


    note that runtime is the equivalent of a PLC CPU. it does not include IO modules but it does processing of all the logic. if you need real hardware IO modules. so you can have EK1100 and some IOs wired up and controlled from your runtime.

    1) read pinned topic: READ FIRST...

    2) if you have an issue with robot, post question in the correct forum section... do NOT contact me directly

    3) read 1 and 2

  • While I can't speak to TwinCat, CodeSys does something similar, and in fact you can buy a runtime license to use regular PC as a PLC with CodeSys, so as to have a "pure software" solution. I don't think it's possible to run safety functions off PC hardware, however. But for non-Safety PLC functions, I've seen a CodeSys "SoftPLC" work perfectly well. The fact that CodeSys will run unlicensed (and un-crippled) for two hours between reboots has come in really handy for "test bench" applications.


    KUKA offers an option package for installing a ProconOS SoftPLC into KRCs, where it runs alongside the robot task. I've used it (many years ago) for operations that required 1ms refresh time. This SoftPLC works b/c KUKA has modified and certified it to "play nice" with the robot task, and created drivers to allow the SoftPLC to share the robot's I/O drivers.


    By comparison, any non-certified 3rd-party SoftPLC (or any random application, really) presents a serious risk of conflicting with KSS for resources is unpredictable ways.

  • This was very generous thread thankyou so much for all the information, I would definitely try using my laptop for Runtime.

    And i was actually already researching about the KUKA.softPLC proconos for KRC. but however thankyou for the suggestion.

  • Beckhoff Twincat can work on kuka pc. I didn't try tc3 but tc2 will working without any problem. Try TC3 installation folder win8settick.bat file and try this after take image of hdd:


    elevated command prompt run the following :-



    bcdedit /set UseLegacyApicMode yes

    bcdedit /set disabledynamictick yes

    bcdedit /set useplatformtick yes

    dism.exe /Online /Disable-Feature:Microsoft-Hyper-V

    perform reboot.

  • M.Ozkan

    What do you mean by Beckhoff TwinCat?

    This is actually a software package consisting of the runtime (soft plc - CoDeSys) and the ide (programming).


    How is the connection from "TwinCat" to the robot?


    KUKA offers a soft plc (e.g. ProconOS SoftPLC as SkyFire mentioned).

    The advantage:

    internal i/o connections, no additional hardware needed

    soft plc can directly access the message mechanism of the robot control (thanks to kuka libraries)


    All the systems I have seen:

    soft plc on robot side

    ide (for programming) on laptop


    I still do not know what capital9 actually wants to do!


    As panic mode mentioned (just for playing) a raspberry pi could be used - just search for openplc

  • As panic mode mentioned (just for playing) a raspberry pi could be used - just search for openplc

    Heck, CodeSys will run on a Pi too -- for only two hours between reboots, if running unlicensed, but that's handy for lab testing and prototyping. CodeSys also has a $60 license for the Pi version, but it's limited to non-commercial use only.

  • Quote

    What do you mean by Beckhoff TwinCat?

    This is actually a software package consisting of the runtime (soft plc - CoDeSys) and the ide (programming).


    How is the connection from "TwinCat" to the robot?


    Twincat runtime and ide can be seperate. IDE installation does not required on robot. User can be assign KONI port for Twincat fieldbus interface and bridge to KLI with industrial switch. I am not recommend this I just say it is possible. Users can be use all supported fieldbus protocol with Twincat for robot communications just like profinet, ethernet/IP etc.. with associated licence. Sometimes Kuka products does not meet different kind requirements and I guess capital9 search a right solution.

  • Thankyou all for the feedbacks,

    MOM

    My intention primarily was to reduce the hardware without using expensive softwares, in simple words cost reduction for commercial application, this is complete research and development kind of work.


    If unsuccessful there are always costly methods for example Proconos and multiprog.

    Using Raspberry PI would work but you guys have already mentioned its for general purpose not for industrial applications.

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